Again and again and again — what are the facts? Shun wishful thinking, ignore divine revelation, forget what "the stars foretell," avoid opinion, care not what the neighbors think, never mind the unguessable "verdict of history" — what are the facts, and to how many decimal places?
You pilot always into an unknown future; facts are your single clue. Get the facts! - Robert Heinlein (1978)
When there are discussions in the absence of a domain, a context in that domain, specific examples of the topic working or not working in that domain and context, over generlizations like all, always, never, orders of magnitude (many confuse X2 with X10), it can't be done, conversations without outcomes, it is always this way, there are billions of issues, Heinlein is likley flipping in his grave.